How God Sees Us Vs How We See Ourselves

Copy and Go to this link: "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpaOjMXyJGk" Take a moment to enjoy this video... Then ask yourself... how do you think GOD SEES YOU? Josh

No Other Gods Before Me Or After Me - An In Depth Look into Isaiah 43:10

I wanted to address a scripture, which is probably the most used by Anti-Mormons and certainly the most mis-quoted. I am a very big stickler about reading scriptures in context and it bothers me when they're not. Scriptures are not written words to mold to one's understanding. They must truly study Ancient Israel in all of its aspects while also having a running understanding of the Bible in order to understand these verses in context. The verse I want to address today is Isaiah 43:10

"Ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me."

If we were to ONLY read this verse without verses 9 leading up to it and 11 after wards, then I can see how easy it would be to go willy nilly in the internet and drop this verse all day long to suit ones purposes. If you were to read it WORD for WORD with these collection of words, as it appears in the English Language, one may possibly be hearing... "No God Formed" and they might loosely interpret this as saying, "No God Created" or "No God Born" but this isn't even what the question is all about. Continuing in verse 11, we learn...

"I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour."

Let's remember at what point in time this was written also. It is late in the years after Israel has already been organized and have been living in the promised land for quite some time. They had already dealt with the introduction of other false God's such as Baal. They have already been influenced by the God's of other nations.

So what is Isaiah really writing? It's the Lord saying the same thing here as he did on Mt. Sanai when he told Moses this:

Thou shalt have NO other GODS before me.
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
(Emphasis Added) *Exodus 20:3-5*

What evidence do we have that there were other Gods that were worshiped before the one true God, the God of Israel? One only needs to go back to the book of Joshua.

Joshua 24:15-16

15 And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.
16 And the people answered and said, God forbid that we should forsake the Lord, to serve other gods;

So we learn that we must not follow after the Gods that were worshiped by Men during ANY other time in the history of this world, that exist now, or can possibly be invented before the great day of judgment shall surely come to pass. The words mis-quoted in Isaiah do not disqualify Men from reaching their true potential. The Lord himself said, "To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne." Revelations 3:30. These are not IDLE words spoken by the Lord to his servant John while on the Isle of Patmos. Those early church members once had a perfect knowledge of their true potential. To him that overcomes the world will be granted the opportunity to rule and reign in the house of Israel as the Kings and Priests which they are.

In conclusion, chapter 43 of Isaiah are the Lord's words to ancient Israel, that they should rely upon ONE savior and only that ONE TRUE MESSIAH and to not follow after the God's who were worshiped in those days, worshiped in the past, or could POSSIBLY be invented in the future. This reference holds no connection to Man's potential to becoming like his Father in Heaven; which I have found more evidence in the Bible than can possibly be written on this blog that supports Man's true potential versus a badly, mis-quoted verse of scripture such as Isaiah 43:10 being quoted out of context. Chapter 43 is all about the Lord's word to Israel. The Lord says: "I am thy God; I will gather thy seed; beside me there is no Savior; ye are my witnesses."

All who belong to covenant Israel are now the witnesses for the Lord and we witness unto the world with the power of the Holy Ghost that there are prophets once again in Israel and for the whole earth. We testify to the world that Isaiah said it best. There is only one name under heaven through which men can receive a forgiveness from their sins and that name is Jesus Christ.

2 Nephi 31: 20-21

Wherefore, ye must press forward with a steadfastness in Christ, having a perfect brightness of hope, and a love of God and of all men. Wherefore, if ye shall press forward, feasting upon the word of Christ, and endure to the end, behold, thus saith the Father: Ye shall have eternal life. And now, behold, my beloved brethren, this is the way; and there is none other way nor name given under heaven whereby man can be saved in the kingdom of God...

If you are already a member of this new and everlasting covenant, then continue to press forward as covenant Israel in these latter-days. Let not the gods of this world occupy your time and attention. Let not the graven images of our world today replace the one true Lord, which is Jesus Christ, in our importance. Let the words of Isaiah, spoken in true context, teach men on earth that there is only ONE God, as far as he is concerned, that we must worship and laud as the only means through which we may be saved in that glorious kingdom which is shortly to come to be. But make no mistake about this...the Bible talks repeatedly about the deification of man and of man's potential to be sanctified and made holy!

Some have confused this passage of scripture to mean that we are all 'judges' and not literal children of God. (See Psalms 82:1,6-8) If you read carefully in this Psalm, it was well understood by the ancient Hebrews that we were literally the 'children of God' being thus also called gods. This did not mean that we were 'immortal' or that we would never die in the sense of how God is, yet. One day our bodies would be renewed and one day we would ALL be immortal. We would all become perfected in Christ and through the atonement, if we gave it cause to work within us. (See Galatians 3:24, Philip. 3:15 (14–15) - See also 2 Tim. 2:10–12, Romans 8:15-18, but best explained by Paul's writings to Timothy.)

John 10:29-39 explains more about why the Lord used the passage in Psalms to explain how he and the father were both divine and enjoyed the same level of Godhood. This does not necessarily explain to the world regarding our 'true potentials' but that this could never be accomplished on our own regardless. The need for a 'savior' and 'sanctification/purification via the baptism of Fire and the refiners fire would still need to enact itself upon those disciples of Jesus..."

John 10: 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and my Father are one. 31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. 32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? 33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. 34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? 35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; 36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? 37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. 38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him. 39 Therefore they sought again to take him: but he escaped out of their hand,"

It wasn't written in error about 'ye are gods' because each one of us are prince's ... which are prince's to become kings and then like the father, who is the King of Kings. This was also well explained in Revelation 1:5-6 - the early saints had no doubt that mankind's potential was to 'join the father' and become like him. Many Early Christian saints held this belief, to be sure.

Potential to become 'like God' is Un-Christian?

Some Christians insist that the doctrine of theosis is unBiblical and unChristian. However, a review of Christian history illustrates that this doctrine was and is a common belief of many Christians.

Irenaeus (ca. AD 115-202) Saint Irenaeus, who may justly be called the first Biblical theologian among the ancient Christians, was a disciple of the great Polycarp, who was a direct disciple of John the Revelator. Irenaeus is not a heretic or unorthodox in traditional Christian circles, yet he shares a belief in theosis:

While man gradually advances and mounts towards perfection; that is, he approaches the eternal. The eternal is perfect; and this is God. Man has first to come into being, then to progress, and by progressing come to manhood, and having reached manhood to increase, and thus increasing to persevere, and persevering to be glorified, and thus see his Lord. Like the LDS, Irenaeus did not believe that this belief in any way displaced God, Christ, or the Holy Ghost: there is none other called God by the Scriptures except the Father of all, and the Son, and those who possess the adoption....Since, therefore, this is sure and stedfast, that no other God or Lord was announced by the Spirit, except Him who, as God, rules over all, together with His Word, and those who receive the Spirit of adoption.

Bibliography Notes: Henry Bettenson, "The Early Christian Fathers: A Selection from the Writings of the Fathers from St. Clement of Rome to St. Athanasius" (London: Oxford University Press, 1956)pages 16–17, page 94. ISBN 0192830090. Visit this link for more research on the matter and the thoughts and beliefs of many other "Christian Fathers" who lived from 100-400 A.D. who held the same beliefs. http://en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_the_nature_of_God/Deification_of_man#endnote_fn1

Man's Potential to Become like his Heavenly Parents

We teach what the Bible mentions as man's potential to become like his heavenly parent. This is not a new concept and was shared by some of the earliest of Christians; (before the Nicean Creed) The concept of Theosis has existed long before that group of philosopher's got together to declare that God is TOO big to understand or too dogmatic. I, for one, choose to believe that God is literally our father in heaven. He is the father of Spirits. Jesus Christ called him, "Abba" which interpreted literally means, "Daddy or Papa"
and we were encouraged to do the same while being members of the covenant... not that being a member gives us some sort of right but it means we acknowledge that he LITERALLY is the father of spirits.
(Compare Rom. 8: 15-18, Galatians 4:6)

Here, below, are examples of men who shared a similar belief that we as latter-day saints do and they did so WELL before God was declared TOO dogmatic for men to dare comprehend:

(This information was found at: http://en.fairmormon.org/Nature_of_God/Deification_of_man )

Irenaeus (ca. AD 115-202)

Saint Irenaeus, who may justly be called the first Biblical theologian among the ancient Christians, was a disciple of the great Polycarp, who was a direct disciple of John the Revelator. Irenaeus is not a heretic or unorthodox in traditional Christian circles, yet he shares a belief in theosis:

While man gradually advances and mounts towards perfection; that is, he approaches the eternal. The eternal is perfect; and this is God. Man has first to come into being, then to progress, and by progressing come to manhood, and having reached manhood to increase, and thus increasing to persevere, and persevering to be glorified, and thus see his Lord.

Like the LDS, Irenaeus did not believe that this belief in any way displaced God, Christ, or the Holy Ghost:

there is none other called God by the Scriptures except the Father of all, and the Son, and those who possess the adoption....Since, therefore, this is sure and stedfast, that no other God or Lord was announced by the Spirit, except Him who, as God, rules over all, together with His Word, and those who receive the Spirit of adoption.

Yet, Irenaeus—whom it is absurd to exclude from the ranks of orthodox Christians—believed in theosis in terms which agree with LDS thinking on the matter:

We were not made gods at our beginning, but first we were made men, then, in the end, gods.

Also:

How then will any be a god, if he has not first been made a man? How can any be perfect when he has only lately been made man? How immortal, if he has not in his mortal nature obeyed his maker? For one's duty is first to observe the discipline of man and thereafter to share in the glory of God.

And:

Our Lord Jesus Christ, the Word of God, of his boundless love, became what we are that he might make us what he himself is.”

And:

But of what gods [does he speak]? [Of those] to whom He says, "I have said, Ye are gods, and all sons of the Most High." To those, no doubt, who have received the grace of the "adoption, by which we cry, Abba Father."

And, Irenaeus considers the doctrine clearly Biblical, just as the LDS do:

For he who holds, without pride and boasting, the true glory (opinion) regarding created things and the Creator, who is the Almighty God of all, and who has granted existence to all; [such an one, ] continuing in His love and subjection, and giving of thanks, shall also receive from Him the greater glory of promotion, looking forward to the time when he shall become like Him who died for him, for He, too, "was made in the likeness of sinful flesh," to condemn sin, and to cast it, as now a condemned thing, away beyond the flesh, but that He might call man forth into His own likeness, assigning him as [His own] imitator to God, and imposing on him His Father's law, in order that he may see God, and granting him power to receive the Father; [being] the Word of God who dwelt in man, and became the Son of man, that He might accustom man to receive God, and God to dwell in man, according to the good pleasure of the Father.

Further quotes from Irenaeus available here.
Said one Protestant theologian of Irenaeus:

Participation in God was carried so far by Irenaeus as to amount to deification. 'We were not made gods in the beginning,' he says, 'but at first men, then at length gods.' This is not to be understood as mere rhetorical exaggeration on Irenaeus' part. He meant the statement to be taken literally.

Clement of Alexandria (AD 150-215)

Clement, an early Christian leader in Alexandria, also taught the doctrine of deification: yea, I say, the Word of God became a man so that you might learn from a man how to become a god.

And:
"...if one knows himself, he will know God, and knowing God will become like God...His is beauty, true beauty, for it is God, and that man becomes god, since God wills it. So Heraclitus was right when he said, "Men are gods, and gods are men."

Those who have been perfected are given their reward and their honors. They have done with their purification, they have done with the rest of their service, though it be a holy service, with the holy; now they become pure in heart, and because of their close intimacy with the Lord there awaits them a restoration to eternal contemplation; and they have received the title of "gods" since they are destined to be enthroned with the other "gods" who are ranked next below the savior.

Origen (ca. AD 185-251)

And thus the first-born of all creation, who is the first to be with God, and to attract to Himself divinity, is a being of more exalted rank than the other gods beside Him, of whom God is the God, as it is written, "The God of gods, the Lord, hath spoken and called the earth." It was by the offices of the first-born that they became gods, for He drew from God in generous measure that they should be made gods, and He communicated it to them according to His own bounty. The true God, then, is "The God," and those who are formed after Him are gods, images, as it were, of Him the prototype.

The Father, then, is proclaimed as the one true God; but besides the true God are many who become gods by participating in God.

Origen also defined what it means to "participate" in something:

Every one who participates in anything, is unquestionably of one essence and nature with him who is partaker of the same thing.

Justin Martyr (d. ca. AD 163)

Justin the Martyr said in 150 A.D. that he wishes

to prove to you that the Holy Ghost reproaches men because they were made like God, free from suffering and death, provided that they kept His commandments, and were deemed deserving of the name of His sons... in the beginning men were made like God, free from suffering and death, and that they are thus deemed worthy of becoming gods and of having power to become sons of the highest...

Also,

[By Psalm 82] it is demonstrated that all men are deemed worthy of becoming “gods,” and even of having power to become sons of the Highest.

Hippolytus (AD 170-236)

Now in all these acts He offered up, as the first-fruits, His own manhood, in order that thou, when thou art in tribulation, mayest not be disheartened, but, confessing thyself to be a man (of like nature with the Redeemer,) mayest dwell in expectation of also receiving what the Father has granted unto this Son...The Deity (by condescension) does not diminish anything of the dignity of His divine perfection having made you even God unto his glory.

Athanasius

In 347, Athanasius, Bishop of Alexandria and participant in the council of Nicea, said:

the Word was made flesh in order that we might be enabled to be made gods....just as the Lord, putting on the body, became a man, so also we men are both deified through His flesh, and henceforth inherit everlasting life...[we are] sons and gods by reason of the word in us.

For as Christ died and was exalted as man, so, as man, is He said to take what, as God, He ever had, that even such a grant of grace might reach to us. For the Word was not impaired in receiving a body, that He should seek to receive a grace, but rather He deified that which He put on, and more than that, gave it graciously to the race of man.

He also states that Christ "became man that we might be made divine."
Augustine (AD 354-430)

Augustine, considered one of the greatest Christian Fathers, said

but He himself that justifies also deifies, for by justifying He makes sons of God. For He has given them power to become the sons of God, (John 1:12). If then we have been made sons of God, we have also been made gods.

Jerome (AD 340-420)

Jerome also described the deification of believers as an act of grace, which matches the LDS understanding precisely:

“I said 'you are gods, all of you sons of the most high.’" let Eunomius hear this, let Arius, who say that the son of God is son in the same way we are. That we are gods is not so by nature, but by grace. “but to as many as receive Him he gave power to becoming sons of God” I made man for that purpose, that from men they may become gods. We are called gods and sons!...[Christ said] "all of you sons of the Most High," it is not possible to be the son of the Most High, unless He Himself is the Most High. I said that all of you would be exalted as I am exalted.

Jerome goes on to say that we should

give thanks to the God of gods. The prophet is referring to those gods of whom it is written: I said ‘you are gods’ and again ‘god arises in the divine assembly’ they who cease to be mere men, abandon the ways of vice an are become perfect, are gods and the sons of the most high...

Modern Christian exegesis

The Westminster Dictionary of Christian Theology describes "deification" thusly:

Deification (Greek Theosis) is for orthodoxy the goal of every Christian. Man, according to the Bible, is ‘made in the image and likeness of God’...it is possible for man to become like God, to become deified, to become God by grace. This doctrine is based on many passages of both O.T. and N.T. (Psalms 82: (81) .6; 2 Peter 1:4), and it is essentially the teaching both of St. Paul, though he tends to use the language of filial adoption (Rom. 8:9-17, Gal. 4:5-7) and the fourth gospel (John 17:21-23).

Joseph Fitzmyer wrote:

The language of 2 Peter is taken up by St. Irenaeus, in his famous phrase, ‘if the Word has been made man, it is so that men may be made gods; (adv. Haer v, pref.), And becomes the standard in Greek theology. In the fourth century St. Athanasius repeats Irenaeus almost word for word, and in the fifth century St. Cyril of Alexandria says that we shall become sons ‘by participation’ (Greek methexis). Deification is the central idea in the spirituality of St. Maximus the confessor, for whom the doctrine is corollary of the incarnation: ‘deification, briefly, is the encompassing and fulfillment of all times and ages’,...and St. Symeon the new theologian at the end of the tenth century writes, ‘he who is God by nature converses with those whom he has made gods by grace, as a friend converses with his friends, face to face...’

Finally, it should be noted that deification does not mean absorption into God, since the deified creature remains itself and distinct. It is the whole human being, body and soul, who is transfigured in the spirit into the likeness of the divine nature, and deification is the goal of every Christian.

According to Christian scholar G.L. Prestige, the ancient Christians “taught that the destiny of man was to become like God, and even to become deified.”

William R. Inge, Archbishop of Canterbury, wrote:

"God became man, that we might become God" was a commonplace of doctrinal theology at least until the time of Augustine, and that "deification holds a very large place in the writings of the fathers...We find it in Irenaeus as well as in Clement, in Athanasius as well in Gregory of Nysee. St. Augustine was no more afraid of deificari in Latin than Origen of apotheosis in Greek...To modern ears the word deification sounds not only strange but arrogant and shocking.

In conclusion:

This view of the early Christians' doctrines is not unique to the Latter-day Saints. Many modern Christian writers have recognized the same doctrines. If the critics do not wish to embrace these ancient doctrines, that is their privilege, but they cannot logically claim that such doctrines are not "Christian." One might fairly ask why modern Christians do not believe that which the ancient Christians insisted upon?UnBiblical?

Theosis has been taught by many Christians through the centuries. They pulled these beliefs from the Bible itself. The Father is the one true God. This thing is certain: no one will ever ascend above Him; no one will ever replace Him.